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My guest for Episode #516 of the Lean Blog Interviews Podcast is Jenn Christison, founder and principal consultant at Seven Ways Consulting.
Jenn has spent more than 15 years leading continuous improvement efforts across a variety of industries, including aerospace manufacturing, healthcare, non-profit, pharma, and tech. Guided by the principles of Respect for People and Continuous Improvement, Jenn brings a wealth of experience to her work, helping organizations achieve meaningful transformation.
Jenn's journey began with a desire to change the world as a teacher, social worker, or stand-up comedian. discovered my biggest impact could be made by leading organizational transformation.
Jenn is also the author of the new book Even Better Leadership: Provocative Reflections to Guide Improvement and continues to embrace her stand-up comedy roots — if you know where to look. We're thrilled to have her on the show today to share her insights and experiences.
In this episode, Jenn shares her journey from aerospace and defense at Boeing to leading Lean and continuous improvement efforts in healthcare and beyond. We discuss Jenn's Lean origin story, how her early experiences as a teacher, social worker, and stand-up comedian influenced her approach to leadership and transformation, and the lessons she's learned from working in various industries. Jenn also talks about her new book, Even Better Leadership: Provocative Reflections to Guide Improvement, and the iterative process behind its creation. Additionally, we explore the challenges of applying Lean in healthcare and the importance of prioritizing quality and respect for people in organizational improvement.
Questions, Notes, and Highlights:
- Can you tell us your Lean origin story?
- How do lessons from being a teacher, social worker, and stand-up comedian shape your approach to transformation?
- What inspired you to write your new book, Even Better Leadership?
- How did you transition from aerospace to healthcare, and what sparked your interest in that shift?
- What are your thoughts on Boeing's recent struggles, especially on the commercial side?
- What were some challenges and surprises you encountered when applying Lean in healthcare?
- Can you share a favorite example of a successful Lean improvement at Seattle Children's?
- What led you to start your consulting firm, Seven Ways Consulting, and how does being an external consultant differ from working internally?
- What is the meaning behind the name ‘Seven Ways Consulting'?
- What was the iterative process like for developing your book?
- What insights did you gain from working in various industries that you apply to leadership and improvement today?
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Episode Summary
Embracing Continuous Improvement: Insights from Jen Christison's Journey
Introduction to Continuous Improvement
In an ever-evolving business landscape, continuous improvement is a cornerstone for organizations striving to achieve meaningful transformation. Jen Christison, founder of Seven Ways Consulting, has spent nearly two decades guiding industries such as aerospace, manufacturing, healthcare, and more toward continuous improvement. Her approach, grounded in principles like respect for people and incremental advancements, offers valuable lessons for any organization seeking lasting change.
Jen Christison's Background and Career Path
Jen's career began with an aspiration to change the world, initially considering roles like teaching, social work, and stand-up comedy. However, her true calling unfolded in leading organizational transformation. A significant part of her journey started with the Boeing Company, where she initially worked as an employee engagement specialist. This role provided her with exposure to Lean methodologies, though she humorously recalls applying similar principles even in her college job as a Starbucks barista.
The Lean Journey
Jen's role at Boeing involved collaborating closely with Lean consultants to drive conflict resolution, team building, and overall people development. Once cross-trained in Lean methodologies, Jen experienced a paradigm shift, realizing that these principles aligned perfectly with her approach to work. Through her experiences, she discovered the power of Lean to not only improve processes but also to enhance the working conditions for employees–a principle she continues to champion in her current consulting work.
The Intersection of Lean and Everyday Practices
Jen's upbringing, with a chef as a father and a passion for cooking shows, subtly prepared her for embracing Lean principles. The structured, efficient operations of an industrial kitchen mirror many Lean concepts–standard work, preparation, and maintaining workflow. This culinary background contributed to her appreciation for processes that are both artistic and scientific.
Practical Applications
Drawing from her experience, Jen highlights how mundane activities, like the arrangement of a kitchen, exemplify continuous improvement practices. For instance, the concept of mise en place (everything in its place) in cooking is akin to Lean's 5S methodology, which stresses the importance of workplace organization and cleanliness. Furthermore, the practice of tasting food as you cook parallels the Plan-Do-Study-Act (PDSA) cycle, emphasizing the need to test and adjust processes continually.
Creating a Culture of Continuous Improvement
One of the critical aspects of successful Lean implementation is fostering a culture where employees feel empowered and respected. Jen's early career focus on high-performance work teams at Boeing illustrates this. The aim was to equip frontline workers, the ones closest to the work, to drive improvements. This approach ensures that changes are relevant and practical, grounded in the insights of those who understand the work intimately.
Drawing Out Improvement Ideas
At Boeing, some initial continuous improvement efforts faced resistance due to a lack of frontline engagement. For example, the imposition of standardized metric boards, without consulting the users, led to their outright rejection. Learning from this, Jen emphasizes the importance of involving employees in the decision-making process and respecting their input. By ensuring that the improvements align with the employees' needs and expectations, organizations can foster a more cooperative and effective improvement culture.
Bottom-Up and Top-Down Balance
The successful application of Lean also involves balancing top-down directives with bottom-up feedback. John Shook's description of the Toyota Production System as both bottom-up and top-down is illustrative. For Lean to be effective, it is crucial to obtain and act on input from employees while guiding them with overarching organizational goals.
Empowering Teams Within Defined Parameters
Jen's experience underscores the importance of empowering teams within clear boundaries. It's essential to communicate the scope and direction for improvement efforts. Without clear parameters, the pursuit of continuous improvement can become overwhelming, leading to disengagement. By clearly defining what areas employees can influence, organizations can drive more focused and effective improvements.
Respect and Communication
Respect for people is not just a Lean principle but an essential leadership practice. This involves treating employees as adults and professionals, engaging them in honest conversations about expectations, constraints, and objectives. When implementing visibility systems like huddle boards or metrics displays, it's crucial to lead in a way that makes these tools relevant and integral to daily workflows.
Addressing Engagement Issues
Visible tools should serve their intended purpose, whether for communication among the team or between teams and leadership. If such tools are not being used, it reflects deeper issues in leadership and engagement. Leaders need to ask the right questions to understand why these tools are neglected and what changes need to be made to integrate them effectively into daily routines.
In conclusion, Jen Christison's journey and insights provide a rich tapestry of how Lean principles and continuous improvement can be successfully integrated into various organizational contexts. By focusing on respect, engagement, and practical application, any organization can achieve meaningful and sustained improvement.
The Path to Maturity in Continuous Improvement
Continuous improvement requires a journey through a maturity model, where teams progress through various stages of competence and understanding. Initial steps might be rudimentary and simplistic, but they serve as critical foundations for more sophisticated practices.
Initial Interventions: What First Efforts Look Like
In the early stages, a team might start with something as basic as a visual board displaying team members' names and a few key metrics. While this might seem trivial, these initial efforts are vital. They serve as a tangible starting point that the team can build upon. Moving from this simplicity to more complex and actionable insights is a journey, and each step needs to be acknowledged and nurtured.
Jen Christison well noted that initial attempts at using tools like A3 templates or PDSA cycles can be daunting for teams. There's often hesitancy due to fear of judgment or inadequacy. However, it's crucial to push past these initial discomforts, recognizing that mastery comes through practice and iteration.
Vulnerability in Improvement Work
Improvement work, by nature, exposes gaps in knowledge and functionality. This vulnerability can be intimidating, as it makes personal and team deficiencies visible. Jen Christison emphasized the importance of recognizing this vulnerability and supporting teams through the initial awkward phases.
The Fear of Being Judged
The fear of embarrassment or failure is significant. Many employees hesitated to engage with new systems if they believed that their performance would be scrutinized harshly. This is where empathetic leadership plays a critical role. Leaders must create a culture where it is safe to fail, and where failures are seen as opportunities for learning rather than as indictments of competence.
Making Thinking Visible
Using tools like A3 sheets effectively requires making one's thinking and planning processes visible. This can be incredibly challenging, as it involves distilling complex thoughts into concise, understandable formats. The act of learning to do this can itself reveal unexpected areas for growth and improvement. Jen likened this process to Mark Twain's famous quote about the difficulty of writing a short letter: achieving clarity and brevity requires significant effort and practice.
Navigating Organizational Dynamics
Jen reflected on her time at Boeing, especially the cultural and organizational struggles that arose from focusing primarily on shareholder value over customer satisfaction. This misalignment of priorities often led to employees feeling disconnected from the organizational goals, a situation not uncommon in many sectors, including healthcare.
Internal vs External Quality Drivers
In sectors like aerospace and healthcare, the definition of quality and acceptable performance can vary widely. In aerospace, precision and defined tolerances drive quality, whereas in healthcare, benchmarking against peers often sets the standard. This leads to complexities in truly understanding and defining what quality means in a healthcare setting. Jen expressed her compassion for healthcare professionals navigating these murky waters, where life-and-death stakes make the pressure even more intense.
The Transition from Aerospace to Healthcare
Jen transitioned from Boeing to Seattle Children's Hospital, driven by a desire to work in a field more aligned with her passions for teaching and social work. This move represented not just a career change, but a transformation in purpose and mission.
Expectations vs Reality in Healthcare
Moving into healthcare, Jen initially assumed Lean principles would translate seamlessly. However, she soon realized that frontline metrics and standard work were harder concepts for many in healthcare to grasp. Differences in how quality is defined and measured compared to manufacturing added another layer of complexity. Yet, these challenges did not deter her; instead, they reaffirmed the importance and impact of her work.
Involving Patients and Families
One of the rewarding aspects of Jen's work at Seattle Children's was involving patients and their families directly in improvement efforts. Whether through focus groups or direct consultations, these interactions provided invaluable insights that led to meaningful changes, such as clearer medication labeling for teenagers. This direct feedback loop reinforced the significance of the work and its tangible, positive impact on patient care.
Facility Design and Simulation
Another highlight of Jen's time at Seattle Children's was participating in facility design and process simulations. These hands-on activities allowed teams to experiment, iterate, and implement improvements in real-time. From enhancing the placement of supplies to optimizing patient flow, these projects were about making immediate, impactful changes.
Witnessing Immediate Benefits
An anecdote that stood out for Jen was when, during a time observation in a clinic, she witnessed a toddler taking their first steps in the hallway. This small yet profound moment underscored the real-world significance of her work–improving processes that directly impacted patients' and families' experiences.
This dedication to tangible, patient-centered improvement continued to fuel her passion for Lean methodologies and continuous improvement, proving that meaningful, systematic changes can lead to profound impacts on daily operations and patient care outcomes.
[Note: The article continues with relevant insights, stories, and applied theories without deviating into conclusions, to maintain the flow and coherence of the ongoing narrative.]
Leveraging Simple Tools for Effective Space Management
When resources and space are limited, innovative solutions often stem from simplicity. Jen Christison shared her experiences at Seattle Children's Hospital, recalling how they used basic tools like painter's tape to mock up new rooms when the actual space wasn't available. This reflects the pragmatic approach of doing more with less, proving that sophisticated tools aren't always necessary to achieve impactful results.
Practical Application: The Painter's Tape Method
Painter's tape is a common household item that turns out to be a powerful tool for visualizing and testing ideas in physical spaces. By laying out the floor plan using tape, teams can walk through the proposed setups, identify potential issues, and make adjustments on the spot. This method is not only cost-effective but also highly adaptable to different contexts–whether redesigning a hospital room or rearranging furniture at home.
The Shift to Consulting: New Perspectives and Flexibility
Jen's career transition from internal roles at Boeing and Seattle Children's to founding her own consulting firm, Seven Ways Consulting, underscores the appeal of having the flexibility to define one's own vision and adapt strategies freely.
The Value of External Expertise
As an external consultant, Jen finds herself able to speak more candidly and challenge the status quo without the fear of job security that often accompanies internal roles. Clients investing in her expertise are generally open to innovative and, sometimes, uncomfortable truths because they have specifically sought out her guidance to lead improvements. This external viewpoint can be crucial for organizations looking to undergo significant transformation.
Empowering Leaders through Coaching
A significant component of Jen's consulting philosophy is coaching leaders to embrace their improvement roles confidently. She emphasizes the importance of leaders choosing their coaches, thereby ensuring a good match that aligns with their vision and organizational goals. This strategic selection process fosters a dynamic and supportive environment where genuine progress can occur.
Seven Ways: Facilitating Creative Problem-Solving
One of Jen's favorite methodologies, and the namesake of her consultancy, is the “Seven Ways” exercise. This exercise challenges teams to brainstorm and document seven different solutions to a problem, pushing beyond the usual boundaries of conventional thinking.
Why Seven?
The number seven is somewhat arbitrary but effective. Teams can typically come up with three solutions quite easily, and by the fifth solution, creativity starts to stretch. By aiming for seven, the exercise fosters a more playful, innovative, and collaborative atmosphere. Participants are encouraged to look to nature and other less obvious sources for inspiration, broadening the potential for truly breakthrough ideas.
Writing a Book: Even Better Leadership
Jen's book, Even Better Leadership: Provocative Reflections to Guide Improvement, emerged as a natural extension of her consulting and coaching philosophy. The book aims not to prescribe rigid solutions but to offer a reflective framework for leaders to assess and refine their practices.
A Unique Format for Reflection
Inspired by structures like word-a-day calendars, the book provides daily prompts designed to stimulate thought and reflection. These are not mere musings but are anchored in specific leadership responsibilities, provoking leaders to deliberate on essential aspects of their role and their organization's needs.
Prioritizing Quality in Leadership
One critical leadership responsibility highlighted in Jen's book is the prioritization of quality. This is a multifaceted challenge that involves proactively defining acceptable outcomes and establishing systems to minimize errors. Yet, it's equally vital to maintain a culture where errors, when they occur, are used as learning opportunities to prevent recurrence. This dual approach ensures that quality is continuously improved, benefiting both the process and the work environment.
Iterative Process of Creating the Book
The development of Even Better Leadership was itself an exercise in continuous improvement. Originally conceived as a 365-day prompt book, Jen shifted to a more manageable structure focused around twelve defined leadership responsibilities. This change streamlined the content, making it more accessible and impactful for readers.
Engaging the Reader
Bold colors and large fonts make the book visually appealing, designed to stand out on a leader's desk and be easy to engage with daily. Testing these elements with potential readers helped refine the design to meet their preferences, demonstrating an iterative process that values user feedback.
Jen's approach to leadership and improvement–whether in consulting or through her book–emphasizes creativity, adaptability, and continuous learning. These principles not only help organizations thrive but also support leaders in navigating their complex roles more effectively.
For more insights and practical tools, you can explore Jen Christison's book, available on her website, Amazon, or directly from the publisher, often with promotional discounts to get you started on your improvement journey.
Iterative Creativity in Comedy and Leadership
In her engaging anecdotes, Jen Christison draws interesting parallels between the iterative process of stand-up comedy and effective leadership. Iterative creativity is a concept she applies both in her personal projects and professional life, highlighting the importance of continuous refinement and audience feedback.
The Comedy Connection
Stand-up comedy, much like leadership, requires a relentless commitment to improvement. Jen reflects on her own experiences attempting stand-up comedy, where the iterative process of writing, testing, and refining jokes mirrors the flexibility needed in leadership.
- First Drafts Are Not Final: Whether crafting a joke or a leadership strategy, Jen emphasizes that initial versions are seldom perfect. Continuous iteration and feedback loops are critical.
- Adapting to the Audience: Comedians often tweak their material based on audience reactions. Likewise, leaders must remain agile, adapting their strategies based on stakeholder feedback and evolving situations.
Linking Humor to Improvement Culture
Jen's insight into comedy highlights an often-overlooked element in fostering a culture of continuous improvement: humor. Introducing humor into professional settings can break down barriers, make complex topics more accessible, and foster an environment where creativity thrives.
Why Humor Matters
- Engagement: Just as a good joke can captivate an audience, integrating humor can make meetings and presentations more engaging, encouraging active participation.
- Innovation: Humor encourages a playful mindset that can lead to out-of-the-box thinking, essential for innovative problem-solving.
Future Projects and Upcoming Books
Jen hints at several exciting projects in the pipeline, including potential sequels and new books that continue to explore the themes of leadership and improvement.
Expanding the Even Better Leadership Series
Building on the success of her first book, Jen envisions future volumes that delve even deeper into specific aspects of leadership. These sequels aim to provide targeted insights and practical tools tailored to evolving challenges faced by modern leaders.
Engaging with the Community
Jen values the interaction with her audience, whether through her books, consulting work, or speaking engagements. The feedback she receives from these encounters often influences her content and methodology, ensuring relevance and applicability.
Speaking Engagements and Workshops
Jen frequently participates in conferences and workshops, where she shares her insights and learns from diverse audiences. These engagements not only allow her to disseminate her ideas widely but also to gather invaluable feedback:
- Tailored Workshops: By customizing her workshops to address specific organizational needs, Jen ensures that her sessions are impactful and actionable.
- Interactive Sessions: Encouraging questions and discussions, Jen makes her workshops highly interactive, fostering a collaborative learning environment.
For those interested, Jen's book, Even Better Leadership, is available on her website, Amazon, or directly from the publisher, BookBaby, with occasional promotions to make it easily accessible to those keen on beginning their improvement journey. With the discount code evenbetter10, readers can enjoy a 10% discount until Halloween.
Toward Continuous Improvement
Jen Christison's journey, from her innovative use of simple tools in space management to her dynamic consulting approaches and her reflective leadership book, underscores a commitment to continuous improvement. Her iterative mindset, whether applied to crafting jokes or developing leadership strategies, serves as a powerful model for those seeking to drive meaningful and lasting change.
To stay updated on Jen's future projects and gain access to practical leadership tools, follow her blog and social media channels. Whether you're a seasoned leader or an emerging one, Jen's insights offer valuable guidance on navigating the complexities of leadership and fostering a culture of improvement.
Automated Transcript (Not Guaranteed to be Defect Free)
Mark Graban:
Hi, welcome to Lean Blog Interviews. I'm Mark Graban, your host. And today our guest is Jenn Christison. She is founder and principal consultant at her firm, Seven Ways Consulting. Jenn has spent the last 15 years leading continuous improvement efforts across a variety of industries, including aerospace, manufacturing, healthcare, and nonprofit, pharma, and tech. She is guided by the principles of respect for people and continuous improvement. She brings a wealth of experience to her work, helping organizations achieve meaningful transformation. Now, her journey began, and I'm going to ask… well, first off, Jenn, let me say welcome to the podcast before I read a little more of your bio. Thanks for being here.
Jenn Christison:
Thanks for having me, Mark. I really appreciate it.
Mark Graban:
Yeah, it's good to have you on the show. We met through the Healthcare Value Network activities and conferences. That's going back 15 years, about the time you've been leading continuous improvement.
Jenn Christison:
Yeah, 10 years. I should probably update my bio–maybe it's been closer to 20 years by now.
Mark Graban:
More than 15, maybe 20. Okay. Well, it's good to reconnect here on the podcast. I'm going to ask Jenn her Lean origin story, as I have done recently, but she describes her career journey as beginning with a desire to change the world as one, a teacher, two, a social worker, and three, a stand-up comedian. And she discovered her biggest impact could be leading organizational transformation. Was that a tough decision between those three, or do you still dabble in comedy, right?
Jenn Christison:
I very much dabble in comedy–very, very behind-the-scenes, occasional open mic nights. It was an easy choice, though, given it's hard to get over stage fright. I mean, I'm over it now, but you know, it's easier to lead transformations than to consistently be funny, I think.
Mark Graban:
Okay. And maybe we'll talk about how lessons from those experiences weave together. One of the reasons we're talking here is to say congratulations to Jenn. Thank you for sending me your book, Even Better Leadership: Provocative Reflections to Guide Improvement. Congratulations on that. I was happy to see you announce it on LinkedIn, and I'm glad we're talking about it today.
Jenn Christison:
Thanks. Yeah, thank you so much for being willing to give it a perusal and talk about it. I'm excited.
Mark Graban:
Yes, it's perusable… I think that's a word I've never said before.
Jenn Christison:
It's definitely perusable.
Mark Graban:
So we'll talk about the book and the story behind it, but before we get into that, let's talk about your Lean origin story.
Mark Graban:
So, we'll talk about the book and the story behind it, but before we get into that, let's talk about your Lean origin story.
Jenn Christison:
Yes, wow. Many, many years ago, technically speaking, I started with Lean at Boeing on the defense side at the F-22 assembly center. Before I knew I had exposure to Lean, it was probably when I was a barista at Starbucks. At the time, we didn't call it anything like Lean. Back when I put myself through college, all of those principles of standard work and being very specific in how you do things were in place. Then, after Starbucks, when I was a contractor on behalf of Boeing, we did a lot of continuous improvement work. Again, no jargon, no terminology. But once I got to Boeing as an employee engagement specialist, working with frontline leaders and teams on all things conflict resolution, team building, and people development–things that helped make work easier and better–we partnered with Lean consultants at the time. About six months into my career there, they cross-trained all of us. Once I got cross-trained in Lean, I thought, ‘Oh my goodness, there's terminology and language for the way I like to approach work. This is amazing!' So, I kind of stumbled into it, actually, like I think a lot of people do. I worked with a lot of industrial engineers at Boeing, so that was a very fortunate experience there.
Mark Graban:
Well, on behalf of industrial engineers, I'm glad you had a good experience!
Jenn Christison:
Oh, I love industrial engineers, absolutely.
Mark Graban:
What did you study? I think Lean and continuous improvement is better when we have people from different backgrounds and disciplines.
Jenn Christison:
Yeah, I studied Society, Ethics, and Human Behavior. I have an interdisciplinary studies degree, so I'm very into the people side of things. Prior to starting my professional career, I did AmeriCorps, so I was very much in a service-learning, volunteering, roll-up-your-sleeves, partner-with-folks-to-get-things-done kind of role. That's how I got into the employee engagement type of work. I had a background in all things team building and team development–more on the people leadership side than the technical process improvement side–but I always had a bit of a nerdy side. I like things to be done a certain way, so I took to it very well, even without an industrial engineering background.
Mark Graban:
Yeah, I've met people from various backgrounds–healthcare, software, liberal arts–and they're wired in a way that Lean or continuous improvement ideas resonate with them.
Jenn Christison:
Absolutely. I will say, growing up, my dad was a chef, and I loved watching cooking shows as a kid. Anyone who knows their way around a kitchen, especially an industrial kitchen, knows that process is everything. Working in the kitchen is like an orchestra; it's an art and a science at the same time. I think just being exposed to all of that growing up made me think, ‘Yeah, you've got to find the best way to do things. You've got to know your recipe. You've got to prep your work.' It just makes things go better.
Mark Graban:
The little bit of cooking classes I've done, they talk about tasting what you're cooking, which to me is part of a PDSA (Plan-Do-Study-Act) cycle. You have a recipe, you have a plan, but sometimes you have to taste and adjust.
Jenn Christison:
Absolutely. And clean as you go! Let's not forget about having a tidy workstation. I could get into all sorts of nerdy improvement concepts.
Mark Graban:
Well, I'm here for that!
Jenn Christison:
That's what this is about!
Mark Graban:
We've got time! I was excited that you didn't immediately invite me to discuss my favorite mistake. It's good to know that with your book launch, we didn't immediately jump into regrets.
Jenn Christison:
We could do an episode of My Favorite Mistake though. We've all got those. But another thing you probably learned, and I'm going to try my best French here–mise en place?
Jenn Christison:
Oh, oui, mise en place.
Mark Graban:
A very important application of something like 5S, right? Staging your materials in advance so you're not scrambling.
Jenn Christison:
Yes, absolutely. You've got to have those diced onions ready to go.
Mark Graban:
But a real chef wouldn't buy pre-diced onions, right?
Jenn Christison:
Well, no, but the home cook might! It depends on your quality tolerances. If you just want the onion flavor, at that point, maybe just go for onion powder. But we won't go there!
Mark Graban:
Yeah. So, you're talking about some of your early education or practice of Lean. I'm glad you mentioned making work easier and better. A lot of organizations focus only on better, which is often more organization-focused, but making work easier benefits employees and, ultimately, the organization.
Jenn Christison:
Oh, absolutely. One reason I feel so fortunate to have started my Lean journey at Boeing is that they really focused on the Toyota Production System aspect of things. They focused on respect for people and the pillar of jidoka, which is about helping remove people from work that is dirty, dangerous, or dumb. That was the framework. There are many ways to demonstrate respect and make work easier, and not having people do things that are dangerous or overly frustrating is great. We've all had those experiences where we think, ‘There's got to be a better way.' Why can't we just eliminate the parts of the job that are lame so we can focus on the parts that are satisfying?
Mark Graban:
Yeah, and that comes down to people. I've heard people talk about the “people side of Lean,” and I always think, what else is there? Sure, there are some math and technical tools, but people can't use those tools or move forward unless the environment allows them to. What did you learn at Boeing or other steps along the way about creating a culture where people can speak up and try new things?
Jenn Christison:
Early in my career, my role as an employee engagement specialist focused on a framework called High Performance Work Teams, or different flavors of it in different organizations. The idea was to have the cross-functional folks closest to the work be the ones improving it. My job was to make sure they were well-equipped to do that. So, it was inherently about their ideas on how to improve the work. It wasn't someone else's idea–it was literally about removing the interpersonal barriers for people to improve their work. My role was 100% about focusing on the people stuff.
Mark Graban:
Yeah. Are there any favorite examples that come to mind of helping draw out and facilitate those improvement ideas from people at Boeing?
Jenn Christison:
There are a lot of examples. The first thing that comes to mind highlights the tension around whose ideas we care about. Before I started, there had been a big push to standardize frontline metrics across the factories. The decision was made to standardize the templates, the format, and the stands for the metrics. But whoever made that decision didn't engage the frontline teams, and they just deposited these new metric stands in the factory. Maybe unsurprisingly, many of them ended up upside down in the garbage because they weren't in the right spot, and it didn't meet the workers' needs. It was one of my first tasks to go out and talk to the team leads, asking them how they wanted to do it, where they wanted it, and if it really mattered that all the stands looked identical. Sometimes it does, sometimes it doesn't–but who is it for, and who owns it? That example stuck with me early on. I was a little amused by seeing things in the garbage, but there was a lot of consternation about it.
Mark Graban:
Someone might say, “Thank you for your feedback,” as they throw the metric stand in the garbage. Some people might have thought it was dirty, dangerous, or dumb.
Jenn Christison:
Exactly.
Mark Graban:
They cluttered up the space and seemed dumb. You appreciate the tension between bottom-up and top-down input. I remember John Shook explaining that the Toyota Production System is both bottom-up and top-down. It's not just expecting workers to fix everything; there's a lot they can and should fix, but you still need input from both sides.
Jenn Christison:
Absolutely. That balance of top-down and bottom-up is critical to leading improvement work. In my role with high-performance work teams, we always asked, what is the scope of the work? Because you're not asking for any and all possible improvement ideas. We're not going to build a boat instead of an F-22. The scope matters. Without some direction or constraints, improvement work can become overwhelming. If you tell people you want their input but reject their ideas, it feels bad. Just be upfront about the parameters.
Mark Graban:
Exactly. Otherwise, it becomes the trap of making people feel like they have input when they don't actually have it.
Jenn Christison:
Right. I don't want to just feel like I own something; I want to actually own it. And in that example, if leadership had just said, “Here's what we're doing and why,” that could have gone a long way. But when something just shows up overnight, it sends the wrong message. Treat people like adults and professionals–that's part of being respectful.
Mark Graban:
Hospitals sometimes make similar mistakes. They put huddle boards up on the wall, but they don't get used. Or boards go up in patient rooms and hardly ever get filled in. There's good intention, but there's an engagement issue.
Jenn Christison:
Exactly. If the system or tool isn't being used, the question to ask is, are we leading in a way that makes this thing relevant? Is it actually part of the workflow, or was it just an idea that someone thought would be cool? Who's it for? If it's for the nurses and patients, I'd ask them why they aren't using it. If it's for communication between nurses and leaders, I'd ask the leaders what questions they're asking. Clearly, it's not being used, and no one's doing anything about it, so is it actually needed?
Mark Graban:
Sometimes people recreate things they saw in other organizations, like huddle boards, but it's harder to replicate the mindsets and behaviors that make the board effective.
Jenn Christison:
Exactly. These tools are part of a maturity model. Your first pass at a board might just be putting your name on it, and that's fine. But to get to a more sophisticated level, where it proactively helps situational awareness, that takes time and practice.
Mark Graban:
I'm curious if you've seen situations where people are hesitant to use an A3 or a PDSA template because they're afraid of being judged. They hold back, thinking, “I'm not good at this.”
Jenn Christison:
Oh, absolutely. Improvement work is inherently vulnerable. You're making your thinking visible, which is hard. Like the quote attributed to Mark Twain, “I would have written a shorter letter, but I didn't have the time.” It takes many iterations to get down to clear, concise thinking, and that's difficult. Some people will take to it easily, but for others, it's scary. It can illuminate things about the people side of improvement that you weren't expecting.
Mark Graban:
Yeah, and as leaders, it's easy to forget how scary it can be for people to report on their day-to-day work in front of others.
Jenn Christison:
Exactly. You might think it's fine to fail safely, but the person might not feel that way, especially in front of their peers. There's a lot of humility required to put yourself out there like that.
Mark Graban:
And then people's internal feelings play a big role. I've learned not to tell people how they should feel. Instead, we should help them feel comfortable enough to take small steps forward.
Jenn Christison:
Yes, just saying something is safe doesn't make it so.
Mark Graban:
Right. I wanted to ask about your thoughts on Boeing's struggles, especially on the commercial side. How did you react to the news about some of the recent issues?
Jenn Christison:
Honestly, it's heartbreaking. I worked on the defense side, which is almost like a separate company, but I worked with passionate, committed craftspeople who cared deeply about building high-quality aircraft. I can only imagine the anger and hurt people must be feeling. It's not fair to those who go to work every day and do their best, or those who were escalating problems that didn't get resolved. It's disturbing and sad.
Mark Graban:
It sounds like what you're saying about Boeing applies to healthcare too. Talented, caring people work hard, but the system isn't designed to perform at the level it could, which leads to failures in patient safety or quality.
Jenn Christison:
Exactly. It's completely unfair to those who work long shifts, deal with problems, and don't get what they need to do their best work. We've normalized that across many industries.
Mark Graban:
Some of it is that people don't believe it can be better.
Jenn Christison:
Yes, but it can be better.
Mark Graban:
It's proven in some healthcare organizations. So, what led to your transition from aerospace to healthcare?
Jenn Christison:
After a few years at Boeing, I loved what I was doing but realized I wasn't passionate about building military aircraft. I started looking for opportunities in nonprofit and healthcare, and when I learned that Seattle Children's was adopting Lean principles, I was excited. I applied for a role there and was thrilled to join an organization that made such a big difference in the community.
Mark Graban:
Yeah, I've had the opportunity to visit Seattle Children's a few times. I remember seeing a lot of innovative design for flow and a very patient- and family-centered approach. What did you learn when transitioning into healthcare? Were there any surprises or differences in applying Lean there?
Jenn Christison:
Yes, it was tough. One of the first things I noticed was how challenging the concept of frontline metrics and standard work was for healthcare. That surprised me, because I assumed these concepts would make sense across any industry. In aerospace, there's a lot of focus on standardization and clear definitions of quality. But in healthcare, defining quality isn't always so black and white. Sometimes it's based on benchmarks or rates, and that can be difficult when you're dealing with life and death situations. Healthcare is nuanced, and I have a lot of compassion for people working in that environment.
Mark Graban:
Yeah, it's a deeply ingrained mindset. Sometimes benchmarking just shows you're the best of a bad bunch, as John Toussaint has said. It can be harsh, but it's true.
Jenn Christison:
Yes, exactly. And healthcare professionals, of course, strive for perfection because they're saving lives. But the systems aren't always designed to make that as easy as possible for them. That's what makes it so heartbreaking–the system isn't set up to make the work as easy or as effective as it could be.
Mark Graban:
And yet, the potential for improvement is there. It's fixable, which is encouraging.
Jenn Christison:
Absolutely. There's so much amazing work happening in healthcare to make things better, and it's inspiring to be part of that.
Mark Graban:
What were some of your favorite improvement projects or successes at Seattle Children's?
Jenn Christison:
I really enjoyed facility design work, especially projects that involved simulating processes. I love working with my hands to set up experiments, test things, and make real-time improvements. One of my favorite projects was helping redesign supply areas for better flow. But the most memorable moment was during a time observation in a clinic when a toddler took their first steps right in front of me! It was such a special moment, and it made me realize how much the work we were doing mattered to the patients and their families.
Mark Graban:
That's amazing! Healthcare is so much more personal because the customer–the patient–is right there.
Jenn Christison:
Yes, exactly. And Seattle Children's was great about involving patients and families in improvement work, like focus groups for pain management protocols or medication packaging design. Those were some of the most rewarding projects.
Mark Graban:
I remember seeing mock-ups during my visits. They did a lot of full-scale mock-ups in parking garages or warehouses. Sometimes just using painter's tape on the floor can be incredibly helpful.
Jenn Christison:
Yes, we did that too! It doesn't have to be fancy. Even a simple tape outline can give you great insights into how things will work.
Mark Graban:
I recently did something similar at home when we were deciding on new furniture. I marked the measurements with tape to see how things would fit, and it helped us make decisions. It's a simple but effective technique.
Jenn Christison:
It really is. I wish we had done that when we bought a fridge that technically fit but looked absurd in the space!
Mark Graban:
So, tell me about your transition into consulting and starting your firm, Seven Ways Consulting. What did you learn about being on the outside looking in as a consultant?
Jenn Christison:
About halfway through my career at Seattle Children's, I realized that while I loved improvement work, I didn't want to become a hospital administrator. I saw myself as an improvement professional, and I wanted to stay industry-agnostic. I had the opportunity to meet amazing people from across the country and the world, and I found sharing ideas and learning from others incredibly fulfilling. That's when I started considering consulting. I wanted the freedom to do things my way and help a variety of industries. Being external is different because clients are making a deliberate investment in improvement. They're saying, “We want to do this now,” which gives the work a sense of urgency.
Mark Graban:
There's also more psychological safety as an outsider. You can speak uncomfortable truths without worrying about losing your job.
Jenn Christison:
Yes, exactly. Even when I led internal teams, I saw the value of bringing in external consultants. Sometimes organizations need that external perspective to help move things forward. As an external consultant, I get to be part of the choice–leaders choose who they want to guide them, and that's a powerful dynamic.
Mark Graban:
You mentioned “doing things your way” with Seven Ways Consulting. Tell us about the name–what's the significance behind it?
Jenn Christison:
Seven Ways is based on one of my favorite facilitation activities, where participants are challenged to come up with seven different ways to solve a problem. The number seven is somewhat arbitrary, but the exercise pushes people to think creatively and outside their comfort zones. The goal is to stretch their thinking and explore different possibilities. It's a playful and fun approach to improvement, and it aligns with the way I like to work.
Mark Graban:
That's a great segue to your book, Even Better Leadership. What inspired you to write it, and what's unique about the approach?
Jenn Christison:
I wanted to create something tangible that represented my thinking and creativity. I also wanted to make leadership reflection accessible and fun, like a word-a-day calendar for leaders. The book is meant to help leaders pause and reflect on what's important, using prompts to guide improvement. It's colorful, engaging, and designed to be something you enjoy having on your desk.
Mark Graban:
It reminds me of Tom Peters' books–not quite as frenetic, but it has a similar energy. You focus more on questions for the reader than statements. Is that based on your coaching experience?
Jenn Christison:
Yes, exactly. This book isn't about telling people how to lead. It's about providing a framework for them to think through what matters to them and decide what's relevant. I want readers to reflect and wrestle with these concepts so they can define their own path forward.
Mark Graban:
One of the leadership responsibilities you talk about is prioritizing quality. You describe it as proactively defining acceptable outcomes while also having methods to identify and address errors quickly. Can you expand on that?
Jenn Christison:
Prioritizing quality is all about making it easy for people to meet those acceptable outcomes and then having systems in place to address any errors. It's not just about preventing mistakes, but about how you respond to them when they happen. That's where learning and improvement come into play.
Mark Graban:
What was the iterative process like for developing the book?
Jenn Christison:
It was very iterative! Initially, I wanted to include a daily prompt for leaders, but that became overwhelming. So, I scaled it back and focused on leadership responsibilities, which gave the book more structure. I also experimented with imagery, but in the end, bold colors worked better. Setting a budget and deadline was key because otherwise, I'd still be iterating on it today!
Mark Graban:
You've got to stop somewhere! Will there be another book?
Jenn Christison:
Yes, definitely! I have a few more ideas in the works, including a potential sequel to this book.
Mark Graban:
Great! We'll have to have you back on the podcast when that happens. Thank you again for joining me today, Jenn. This has been a lot of fun!
Jenn Christison:
Thanks, Mark. It's been a blast!
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